Whiners Corner
Forums > Whiners Corner (Archives) > Balance issues on 2fort when flag running.Search | New Thread
Thread Locked. You cannot edit or reply to any messages.
Balance issues on 2fort when flag running.
 
Page 1, 2, 3, 4 | Next Page
Reckoner
Super Regular
Crack-Powered Capper

P: 11/22/2014 19:47 EST
   
Poll: Where do you go with the flag?
Spiral (56%)
Elevator (33%)
Teleporting the flag with teleporter (11%)
Poll has ended (it ran for 7 days). 9 total votes.
Noooo! :o I just saw one of my buddies (Sincere I think, playing medic) trying to go elevator with the flag, but of course, a heavy weapons guy who was guarding/blocking the top of the elevator most of the game, jumped down.

We would have lost the game anyway, but maybe a consolation capture of the flag would not have been bad. It's still a team based game and I think if you go for the elevator with the flag in a big game (10 vs 10 at least), then you're not a team player. >:p

It's hard for other classes/players on your team to assault the ramp room & elevator. If the flag happens to be in the elevator, top or bottom... I much prefer to just wait for it to return to the flag room.

The elevator is much easier to defend. On that note, do not go elevator with the flag if it's the first cap your team has to make. >:( If it's a 0 - 0 scoreline, just and I mean just go spiral for the love of humanity. Harder to defend there for the opposing team y'know.

Easier for your team to assist you with emps, mirvs and what not when you push the flag to the top of the spiral area.

Second point, I should probably leave certain games earlier. =( Lots of new players in the server and sometimes I notice that I'm the only player on my team with a positive score (positive k/d ratio) and I'm even playing offensive medic /end brag. :(

I guess I just played too much tfc the last week. Usually when you play a certain game too long or too much and you can't seem to improve your individual qualities that much anymore, then you start complaining about the imbalances in that game and about other players on your team.

What else is there to enjoy in life? Any good movies coming out in December? :P
  
Ritual_Masturbator
Super Regular
Engineer Flag
Toucher

P: 11/22/2014 21:02 EST
    Movies are mostly shit these days. Interstellar is good, a few decent ones, and I've run out of the good stuff to talk about.

Difficult to play a match when the folks on your team either only cares about defense (and sucking badly at it) or only cares about his # of caps over yours (like siNcere - in fact I see him RQ whenever his team sucks, then reconnect and play with the winning team).
  
yousnoozeyoudie
Super Regular
Dizzy Capper

P: 11/22/2014 21:18 EST
    Hunger games just came out. The Hobbit comes out in Dec.

Interstellar was good until the last 30 minutes turned to shit.
  
elf poo
Super Regular
WMD Creator

P: 11/23/2014 04:01 EST
    Exodus: God and Kings, looks good also.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FByPdk-3LJQ
  
Ignorant_Florist
Daycare Manager
Pipebomb Monkey

P: 11/23/2014 05:27 EST
   
Reckoner wrote:
Noooo! :o I just saw one of my buddies (Sincere I think, playing medic) trying to go elevator with the flag, but of course, a heavy weapons guy who was guarding/blocking the top of the elevator most of the game, jumped down.

We would have lost the game anyway, but maybe a consolation capture of the flag would not have been bad. It's still a team based game and I think if you go for the elevator with the flag in a big game (10 vs 10 at least), then you're not a team player. >:p

It's hard for other classes/players on your team to assault the ramp room & elevator. If the flag happens to be in the elevator, top or bottom... I much prefer to just wait for it to return to the flag room.

The elevator is much easier to defend. On that note, do not go elevator with the flag if it's the first cap your team has to make. >:( If it's a 0 - 0 scoreline, just and I mean just go spiral for the love of humanity. Harder to defend there for the opposing team y'know.

Easier for your team to assist you with emps, mirvs and what not when you push the flag to the top of the spiral area.

Second point, I should probably leave certain games earlier. =( Lots of new players in the server and sometimes I notice that I'm the only player on my team with a positive score (positive k/d ratio) and I'm even playing offensive medic /end brag. :(

I guess I just played too much tfc the last week. Usually when you play a certain game too long or too much and you can't seem to improve your individual qualities that much anymore, then you start complaining about the imbalances in that game and about other players on your team.

What else is there to enjoy in life? Any good movies coming out in December? :P
You sir, are full of shit.

The elevator is pretty fucking EASY to get out of. Hell, I can do it 90+% of the time, even while being chased. It may take a smidgeon of practice to get the conc/nade timing correct, but once you know..... you're getting out.

Now, if the HW drops down, and raises the lift, you have one of two options: Back track and head for the spiral, or conc that fuck, and run past him while priming the jump-nade(usually a conc, but if you're out, a frag nade CAN work).

Face it, kid.... the spiral is one LONG, WINDING, choke point. The lift has only 2 issues: The lift itself *IF* someone drops down and makes it go up, blocking the way.... and that 2 foot deep doorway. Hell, if you get to the top and meet resistance, THROW the fucking flag through it(default key "C")! It's a fuck-ton easier to get in the ramp room, than ANYWHERE in the spiral.

I've seen 2 sollies lock down the Spiral. One near the top, and one near the bottom. One player in the Ele can be gotten past, even though THEY think they have it locked down.

That concludes todays TFC lesson. As for movies...........
No. Everything hollyweird produces these days is pretty much shit designed to take your money.
  
Ritual_Masturbator
Super Regular
Engineer Flag
Toucher

P: 11/23/2014 05:44 EST
    I've run past fatties, demos and sollys as an engy holding their flag. 2 sollys is a cakewalk.  
Reckoner
Super Regular
Crack-Powered Capper

P: 11/23/2014 06:09 EST
    Now that we're talking statistics/percentages... >:p Of the # 7020 flag captures I have made, I went for the spiral 197 times out of 200 with great success. Somewhere around that number. :P And I'm not like an in-experienced player on this server I think.

There are theories behind the madness. HW guy top elevator is much harder to get passed by than a HW guy in the top of the spiral. That has to be a fact. Also because I enter the enemy basement from the spiral more, way more than I do by using the elevator then I know it's safe.

On a few occassions when I hear like my team saying: "Teleporter from spawn to enemy elevator." Then I know that the elevator is a very reliable option from when I do a flag run. It makes more sense that if the rest of the offense on your team is pushing the spiral for you to do the same. Because you know it's safe.

Also if you clear the spiral (and you haven't checked out the elevator yet) then it's best to go through the spiral again with the flag. You don't wanna run into a sentry gun top elevator because you didn't clear it before. :o

There isn't much room left to mess up a flag run when you go for the elevator. The enemy communicates, voice chat being the most reliable way: Flag in danger > He's going ele!

The flag on the elevator pad at the bottom is terrible for big pushes. Makes it a tedious wait for the flag to return to the flagroom.

Often I hear engineers/other classes using the teleporter leading to the basement resupply, after they get fragged in the basement, sometimes anticipating that the opposing player could go for the elevator and making that option a big no go. They prime a nade before they enter the teleporter at times.

And if they respawn in the main spawn room, they could eleminate the elevator completely as an option by going from the main spawn to the elevator faster than I can take out 2 sentry guns in the basement. If I have a conc left or a regular nade, then the spiral is great. I conc from the flagroom tunnel and out the long hall (the long hall is closer to the spiral than the short hall).

With a regular nade you can knock back the soldier standing at/blocking the bottom of the spiral. If the soldier is fast enough, they usually wait at the end of the long hall/middle of the basement. That's when the conc or regular nade comes in handy.

  
Kwyjibo42
Super Regular
Cold Giver

P: 11/23/2014 06:09 EST
    I agree with Iggy, backdoor to ele works way more than it should. It sucks to point it out, but for the most part nobody wants to stay at top ele as an hw and stare at the wall until something happens. Most people have a more active mindset than that.   
LGMB95033
Super Regular
Deadly Dispenser
Man

P: 11/23/2014 08:21 EST
    Just play the game bitches!   
Ignorant_Florist
Daycare Manager
Pipebomb Monkey

P: 11/23/2014 08:30 EST
    I'm going to answer point to point, if you don't mind:

Reckoner wrote:
Now that we're talking statistics/percentages... >:p Of the # 7020 flag captures I have made, I went for the spiral 197 times out of 200 with great success. Somewhere around that number. :P And I'm not like an in-experienced player on this server I think.
It partially depends on what time of day you play. I see you quite a bit in the late morning/early afternoon(my time) hours. 8v8 is a much different game than 13v13.

There are theories behind the madness. HW guy top elevator is much harder to get passed by than a HW guy in the top of the spiral. That has to be a fact. Also because I enter the enemy basement from the spiral more, way more than I do by using the elevator then I know it's safe.
Nonsense. If you KNOW he's up there, he's still easy to get around.... much easier than the spiral filled with defenders. Conc his ass out of the doorway, and you're clear. If you can't, throw the flag through the door. At worst, the fatty is in the doorway trying to block your escape. If he's not, easy peasy to get past.

On a few occassions when I hear like my team saying: "Teleporter from spawn to enemy elevator." Then I know that the elevator is a very reliable option from when I do a flag run. It makes more sense that if the rest of the offense on your team is pushing the spiral for you to do the same. Because you know it's safe.
Actually, there are 2 distinct sounds that alert the enemy D to cover the elevator: 1) Pissing in the Urinal, and 2) the sound of a teleport.
As for the Spiral, I've seen it many, many times. Hundreds, if not thousands over the years: Flag gets halfway up the Spiral, 6 D players converge to cover it.... your team dies a dozen times each without getting a touch on it. It goes back.
Now, if you're smart, and know the flag is about to go back, you take advantage of everyone covering the Spiral, and take the elevator while the other O on your team keeps the pressure up on the Spiral. Flag goes back, you grab it, and head up the lift. It's a matter of numbers. You're less likely to get past 6 than you are 1.

Also if you clear the spiral (and you haven't checked out the elevator yet) then it's best to go through the spiral again with the flag. You don't wanna run into a sentry gun top elevator because you didn't clear it before. :o
Nonsense. Not many Engies put one up there. Usually it's a Solly or a HW. With an occasional Demo tossed in. Despite what you think, it's possible to get the flag passed a pipe trap: As you reach the top of the ele, keep your finger right above the "C"(default for Drop Item) key. If you see the pipes, press it. If not, keep running.

There isn't much room left to mess up a flag run when you go for the elevator. The enemy communicates, voice chat being the most reliable way: Flag in danger > He's going ele!

The flag on the elevator pad at the bottom is terrible for big pushes. Makes it a tedious wait for the flag to return to the flagroom.
In some ways, yes.... but this is D2F we're talking about here. At best, you have half a decent team, and half newbies. Spread that decent part of the team between O and D, and you're looking at maybe 4 decent defenders. Usually, they don't crowd the same point.... they cover multiple sides. Spread out, it's not that difficult to prime a conc while you drop down, place it, grab the flag as it goes off, and up you go.
Often I hear engineers/other classes using the teleporter leading to the basement resupply, after they get fragged in the basement, sometimes anticipating that the opposing player could go for the elevator and making that option a big no go. They prime a nade before they enter the teleporter at times.
This is why I go for teleporter entrances in Sniper Side. That 8 second delay to rebuild it can make the difference.

And if they respawn in the main spawn room, they could eleminate the elevator completely as an option by going from the main spawn to the elevator faster than I can take out 2 sentry guns in the basement. If I have a conc left or a regular nade, then the spiral is great. I conc from the flagroom tunnel and out the long hall (the long hall is closer to the spiral than the short hall).
From what I've seen, it's a 75% chance they head for the spiral, rather than the elevator.

With a regular nade you can knock back the soldier standing at/blocking the bottom of the spiral. If the soldier is fast enough, they usually wait at the end of the long hall/middle of the basement. That's when the conc or regular nade comes in handy.
Unless that Soldier knows how to "conc-aim"(not hack it, but the reality of it).... in which case, you're fucked.
  
DeathBringer
Super Regular
Pipey FlagCatcher

P: 11/23/2014 09:16 EST
E: 11/23/2014 09:21 EST
    If I hear the flag is nabbed and they may go ele I stand up top so lift is up. Conc that while blue pipes rain down on you lol.
I agree most times offense takes the spiral instead of ele especially on higher player count games. Thats why I hang out in the spiral.(with 2 pipes in the RSH just to be evil)
  
Reckoner
Super Regular
Crack-Powered Capper

P: 11/23/2014 12:44 EST
    I have to agree with most of the good points you make Iggy in your latest response. ^__^

I based the first post in this thread mostly on recent experiences on the server and continued on the same line in the follow up post.

It's true that there are more less experienced players in the server now, or that Drippy doesn't always auto balance when the game starts.

I thought I was noticing a trend of some sorts. Not sure if for example Frankie Spankie still plays these days, but he did used to go for the elevator a lot as a scout/medic with good success.

Thanks, Iggy for your responses. ^__^ I will process them for a bit and maybe improve my game further. >:o
  
[GDP]RisKFactoR.h5![Pirate!]
Regular
Grenade Powered
Soldier

P: 11/23/2014 19:14 EST
E: 11/23/2014 19:45 EST
   
yousnoozeyoudie wrote:
Hunger games just came out. The Hobbit comes out in Dec.

Interstellar was good until the last 30 minutes turned to shit.
^^^^ This!

I agree. Last 30 minutes was a wasted piece of shit. I mean, I understand what it was about. But But if you have zero understanding of how gravity could play around with time and space, it would have been like: WTF is going on? And even then, it was like: "WTF?"

It was totally disjointed from the rest of the movie. WAY too much of a digression.

Ignorant_Florist wrote:
The elevator is pretty fucking EASY to get out of. Hell, I can do it 90+% of the time, even while being chased. It may take a smidgeon of practice to get the conc/nade timing correct, but once you know..... you're getting out.

Now, if the HW drops down, and raises the lift, you have one of two options: Back track and head for the spiral, or conc that fuck, and run past him while priming the jump-nade(usually a conc, but if you're out, a frag nade CAN work).

Face it, kid.... the spiral is one LONG, WINDING, choke point. The lift has only 2 issues: The lift itself *IF* someone drops down and makes it go up, blocking the way.... and that 2 foot deep doorway. Hell, if you get to the top and meet resistance, THROW the fucking flag through it(default key "C")! It's a fuck-ton easier to get in the ramp room, than ANYWHERE in the spiral.

I've seen 2 sollies lock down the Spiral. One near the top, and one near the bottom. One player in the Ele can be gotten past, even though THEY think they have it locked down.

That concludes todays TFC lesson. As for movies...........
No. Everything hollyweird produces these days is pretty much shit designed to take your money.
^^^^ This. As a defensive soldier, I LOVE defending the elevator, especially on a bad team, against good offensive medics. (Am I the only one that loves to play on a bad team!?)

It can be a bit of a challenge to defend that spot as a solly on a bad team. Medics, all you have to do is conc me, and go for the elevator. Much easier than the log jam that is the spiral.

If all else fails on my part, I do run for the elevator, even if the fall will kill me. I love to raise the elevator as the medic is trying to get to the shaft. Delays them just enough for me to respawn, and come back.

Also, many times, sincere does this, you can catch the ele D off guard if you come up the shaft with the flag. Because a good 90% of the time, when the opposing team grabs the flag, they go up the spiral. Even if I am standing guard at the ele, once in a while, you can come up, and run right by me untouched.

Playing as soldier on O, I love to use the elevator, both ways. It isn't that hard to slip by someone to get down there. If I have the flag and enough health, coming back up is a great option. Just simply nade then rocket jump, or double-rocket jump up the shaft, and toss it out in case you screw it up. </quote>
Ignorant_Florist wrote:
Actually, there are 2 distinct sounds that alert the enemy D to cover the elevator: 1) Pissing in the Urinal, and 2) the sound of a teleport.
As for the Spiral, I've seen it many, many times. Hundreds, if not thousands over the years: Flag gets halfway up the Spiral, 6 D players converge to cover it.... your team dies a dozen times each without getting a touch on it. It goes back.
Now, if you're smart, and know the flag is about to go back, you take advantage of everyone covering the Spiral, and take the elevator while the other O on your team keeps the pressure up on the Spiral. Flag goes back, you grab it, and head up the lift. It's a matter of numbers. You're less likely to get past 6 than you are 1.
^ This again.

I said this:

Also, many times, sincere does this, you can catch the ele D off guard if you come up the shaft with the flag. Because a good 90% of the time, when the opposing team grabs the flag, they go up the spiral. Even if I am standing guard at the ele, once in a while, you can come up, and run right by me untouched.
When I hear the voice-over say: "Enemy has the flag," and 90% of the time the team tries to use the spiral. Reason why I do not run back to look down the elevator shaft for someone like sincere to conc up with the flag.

What happens, is that virtually everyone on the server loves to head to the spiral if the opposing team has the flag coming up the spiral. Everyone dies a dozen times defending/trying to get the flag. Once in a while, you'll have a decent medic, like Sincere (much as I do not like him, he is decent,) run the "backway," the elevator, and run UP the spiral behind everyone to attempt to grab the flag.

In order to prevent someone just easily using the ele to come up the spiral behind everyone, I have to be looking into the ramproom, and doing my best to keep a really good medic from beating me. At the very least, I can make the elevator come up, delaying the medic for at least one or two seconds, while I yell into the mic at people to pay attention to their backs in the spiral LOL.

And usually, I am virtually the only one standing there, as spam is going on like crazy at the spiral entrance.

So, when I hear, for the first time, "The enemy has your flag," I am thinking: "Spiral! He's gonna go spiral!" And I see a million people converge on spiral. I think: "Geez, I am the only one thinking of the backway!" And so, I pay attention to the ramp room. If it's sincere, he'll just simply bypass the spiral, go ele, and I am facing the "wrong" way. He'll just run right by me, and out the front door untouched, while the rest of the server is uselessly killing one another/spamming/wasting nades in front of the spiral.

I will say, though, it is kind of funny when everyone is fighting at spiral entrance. A good medic actually doing his job trying to get the flag by going a different route. I am the only one covering that alternate route. What happens in the ramproom in that fight between me and the medic, is FAR more important than all the server spam going on at spiral entrance.
  
Reckoner
Super Regular
Crack-Powered Capper

P: 11/24/2014 01:25 EST
    Just go for the goddamn spiral with the damn flag. Don't be the idiot hero. Also, the team with the most snipers will lose the game. Sentry gun x flag does nothing, build it left, right of the flag or in the center of the flagroom. And please build it in a way so that players can't circle around it while nailgunning it. >:p

13 vs 13 games can be interesting though, not always, but sometimes there are entertaining games.

I've seen some crazy shit, but I'm glad that certain fucktards are now out of this game. Fighting over 1 server in a half life 1 engine game, trying to get people banned, wtf. >:o And.., I'll take a break by the end of this month again. >:( Grrr.

Because it's time to d-d-d-du-duel! Yu-gi-oh! >:)
  
Shemmie
Super Regular
Deadly Dispenser
Man

P: 11/24/2014 01:47 EST
E: 11/24/2014 01:48 EST
   
Reckoner wrote:
...but I'm glad that certain fucktards are now out of this game.
!fuckin dutch.

<3 Miss playing with you dude.
  
Page 1, 2, 3, 4 | Next Page
Forums > Whiners Corner (Archives) > Balance issues on 2fort when flag running.